From Gneurosis, Issue 1, pp 9-10
The interview also came with a partial discography, including releases up to 1991 (the Salute reissue
on Aeroplane). Mentioned in that discography is "Delta", an upcoming LP on Dom Bartwuchs (planned as DOMBW05)
that was never released in that format, though the music was made available on another subsequent release
(who's name escapes me right now....)
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You frequently mention the importance of collective playing in the construction of your pieces, saying how
the playing can "come together" very strongly at times, although you're obviously the originator
of the Organum oeuvre. It sets me wondering if there's still any influence from the Scratch Orchestra?
The Scratch Orchestra was 20 years ago and there's no direct influence left that I'm aware of. What
the orchestra initially did was provide a situation of permission-to-act, where I could begin to find
my own way in music. It was a vital experience and I'm grateful for it. When the Maoist influence later
made itself felt in the Orchestra, the group's music and internal personal relationships began to
deteriorate quite fast and the situation lost all its charm for me. But the free-wheeling first two years
of the Orchestra's existance were an excellent grounding in performance and sound-making. Having
said that, when we performed a 15 minute set at the Recommended Records shop there was some
wandering around, walking downstairs and so on, while we were actually playing the music that does
remind me of the sort of thing the Scratch Orchestra would have done.
This does rather make me wonder about how the music's made - you seem a bit cagey about giving much away
regarding instruments, scoring, etc. Is the music non-intentional at all?
No. Organum music is certainly not non-intentional. The work of John Cage, to which I presume
you're indirectly referring, remains interesting, refreshing and entertaining, but chance procedures
have never been of central artistic importance for me. I like form and I like to shape it. Sometimes
I've used a kind of verbal score, where I just give a set pf very basic instructions, or ideas, to the
players which will shape their performance.
Are you iunfluenced by any hermetic material?
No. I've never read any. For me, most philosophies and religions are a bit of a nonsense, I'm afraid,
and I give them a wide berth. I find that it's no longer personally acceptable nor in any way desirable
to be excessively clogged up with other people's thoughts.
Well I was going to ask if there's any influence of mysticism, are you sure there isn't?
I really don't know... Maybe I'm confusing mysticism with meditation. I have some sympathy with
meditation but it's impossible to say whether or not that's had any influence on my music. The word
'mysticism', like the word 'spirituality' doesn't seem to bear up to much scrutinty. The more you
examine it, the less it means.
There's a definite 'feel' to your music. Apart from your rather NWW-ish tracks on the LAYLAH 'Fight Is On'
compilation it would be difficult to mistake most Organum music for anybody else's - otherwise I wouldn't
have bothered getting into it, and eventually endevouring to interview you! So, in fact, are the
aesthetics (not just of the music, but sleeve design, titles, etc) by a happy coincidence congruent with any
'accidental' qualities of construction?
Not really, because even in the most chaotic works I am intensely concerned with the overall shape,
and with controlling that shape. Lucky accidents that occur in the making of a piece are absolutely
subservient to that control.
Do you deliberately aim for a particular atmosphere?
Not very often. Usually, I don't deliberately aim for anything. It just seems to happen that the works
grow and take on their own definite shape and feeling as they're made. Really, I work only with the
sounds, not with ideas. What usually appears at the start of work on most Organum pieces is the
threat of the collapse of meaning - I never know whether or not a track will make it. So there is usually
total uncertainty. It is overcome, or abolished, by the desire to shape form, by the affection hat I have
for the sounds being used, and by the excitment which flows out of that. Apart from these things,
it's useless to ask me about intentional meaning. Whatever other 'meaning' a piece has is after the
event, not before. And meaning for the artist and meaning for the audience may be quite different.
There's the unpredictability of context to contend with and, just to thoroughly confuse everything,
there's the inability of people, myself included, to just listen rather than project onto the work. So
questions of meaning can open up a vast abyss. If I sat and thought about it too much, I'd never play
a note. The work is neither non-intentional in terms of chance preocedures, nor intentional in terms of
fulfilling some prescription.
A lot of your music features bowed cymbals, shakuhachi, etc... is it actually modern music as far as you're
concerned?
I don't have much of a position on modernism. Although most good art of this century has been
based on very self-consciously taking some hard-line stance or other about what should or shouldn't
be done, I simply don't do that. I just really love the sounds that I use, so I use them. And anyone
who says that, "Right now, such-and-such is so, for Art", deserves a good verbal kicking in my opinion.
We don't need any more police in this world. So I'm indifferent as to whether or not my work is
'modern'. Apart from the instruments you mention I've also used a home made tone generator,
guitars, and wire stretched over a soundboard.
Why is there so much bowed sound in your work?
Because I like it. Also, it's the way I get the drone element into my music, and I am very much in lvoe
with the drone.
How is it that environmental sounds have appeared in your work, such as Vacant Lights and Submission?
I rather enjoy them, so it feels natural to include them in the music from time to time. The way I use
them they rather function somewhat like a drone, so they fit fairly easily into the Organum sound.
Have you any particular view of history?
I have no such view. The only history that I'm truly aware of is my own.
Why are you so interested in entrails?
I'm not particularly, though you might say I do have a certain gut feeling for such imagery, ha ha. No,
biomorphic shapes I like and that's as far as it goes. And you can't get much more biomorphic than
the organs of the human body.
Your last few releases were all 7"s (Drome, Iuel, Meister Nix). Why are you making a lot of shorter
releases these days?
I wasn't aware that I was. With my work, the programme for each release is exactly the length that it
needs to be. So short or long isn't really an issue, except that with the advent of CD the options have
now been dramatically narrowed. The costs involved in CD production mean that you're more or less
obliged to produce a full-length album every time. That's why I've stayed with vinyl - it better suits my
way or working.